Re: News from the Jungle

From: Betsy Feuerstein ecuador at midsouth.rr.com> on 2001.05.18 at 14:35:23(6506) My blood pressure just rose about a thousand points. I feel like I have just been told what I should do and that the collecting should be left to botanists. If there were enough botanists in the world to collect what is left that would be fine, but there are not. Many botanists refuse to share what they collect and grow and many don't collect living material. Then the question of paying is a legitimate question, but when Big Brother, The World Bank, and others promulagate that all must be left in country, one who knows, who has been der done dat, is aware that slash and burn, cut and farm for a short time, clean the side of the roads, leaves a terrain with nothing that resembles a rain forest. Little is left of what was, little has been collected by botanists AND collectors, of what was, and even less is in living form of what plants there were. Now, commerical or greed, strip collecting is another thing. I totally agree that such be stopped and made unprofitable. I have seen this done in orchids and cycads, but not in aroids. Remember downed tree areas do not remain. If not collected at that very time, within six months almost nothing of what was, will remain. Is there harm in harvesting such material or is there potentially great benefit in taking that material, sharing with the botanists with appropriate honest collecting data and with other plant collectors? Now if money passes hands to make that possible, so be it. I have had many say to me that plants did not cost me anything because I just took them from the ground and I have learned to control my anger and just walk away. Anyone that stupid, needs a head check. My time, my travel expenses, my efforts to re-establish a collected plant, my money spent to get appropriate help in the process, and then my efforts to keep records for the botanists ALL require great effort and a LOT of money. Say anything about the great cost of maintaining the home front while one is gone by paying others to love your collection as you do. Now mention the medical expenses of recouperating from the collected body ailments that accrue from international travel from the runs to ameobic dysentary and worse. And what about the cost of maintaining a greenhouse, a shade house, a plant collection in general, from potting soils, to insecticides, to snail and slug deterrant, and so on. You get the message, you could not pay me enough on the scale that I do, to make this a truly break even endeavor. Would I prefer to do collecting with permits from the country of origin? YOU bet I would!!!!! Would I pay dearly for the privilege? YES! If all was being left in situ just as pristine as nature provided, there would be no reason to collect because it would potentially be there forever. Taking my head from the sand for just a moment, it all is disappearing at some gross rate beyond human perception. Look at a space photo of what is left today and then look again tomorrow and six months down the road. The little guy in country is generally not deprived by anything I take. Now, the drug companies certainly would be more than willing to get the information from the shaman and bring home the plant material, refine so patentable, and leave the little guy sitting high and dry. No question, these people have by tradition preserved their observable information. When great money and power are in the equation, the little guy is nothing. Do I agree with that one? Absolutely not! If, as a society, we were smart enough to use the natural products, not patentable, with its few or no side affects, the source could be the little guy and his jungle, but no, the drug companies want a patentable product so it must be altered and refined into a poison, with major side affects. When we, the little people of the home front, find the way to insist that we honor nature in its raw form, which we have started to do, we will begin to unlock the little guy who lives from the jungle as his resource. Society often says, slash and burn, grow grass for cattle and in a very limited time, very little but sedge grows and the little guy moves on to new and usable territory. In the process, all or most of the unknown botanical material is LOST. Now, give me permits to collect and charge me for that permit, gives each country ever so needed income for their debt ridden coffers. Put limitations on that permit to a time limit, to a number of plants, to make herbarium specimen and deposit such at designated repositories. Whatever, but accept the reality, it won't be long and it won't be there for historical heritage or the world. I am not talking tomorrow, but I am talking TODAY. Why not take advantage of an asset with whatever limitations seen fit and allow what can be preserved and maintained for future generations. And let it be done with integrity instead of bribe. Now, I just put my head back into the sand, I realize. Bribery, is a cultural reality in many if not most of the rest of the world and perhaps here/USA also. The old expression, 'when in Rome, do as the Romans,' may just have to be part of the equation for anything to work in much of the world. When I am in country, I use as much help as I can get, use the products and resources of the country and pay far more than is normally received in ordinary commerce in the country. That has its good and its bad perspective. If I pay more than is normally paid in country, then the workers come to expect more from the in country trade and certainly, when I return they demand more and more. Difficult to determine if it is better to stay within the norm or to be generous by our standards. Perhaps it is even more important to respect what we see as help. Appreciate their assistance and do not look down on what they do. Our society often sees manual efforts as less than. Perhaps it is time to appreciate all help not by looking down, but as equal. You see, there are still answers to be worked out. Okay, I just blew my top. I love to collect and grow plants. I love to think by sharing I have helped in the process of botanical collecting and preservation not only in dry form, but in living form. Perhaps a collaborative effort between the sometimes very arrogant seclusive botanical world and the little guy who loves to grow, see things in the wild, and who would love to be a part of making what is now, be here down the road, might be very advantageous for all. We are going to have to learn a mutual respect and to learn to work together. I am fully aware that in the middle of the equation there is a greedy commercial factor that wants control of the genetic material, especially in orchids. I have not dealt with them, but for the picture to clarify, they too will have to get into the collaborative mode. There are those whom, I have known, who would not tell a botanist where they collected anything correctly. False information is a control/power factor and one I would like to see avoided. Perhaps if we could eliminate one upsmanship with I have what you do not or you can't get, and we learn to work together for the good of all, we might take a step forward. Will any of this happen in my lifetime? I hope so. I am not holding my breath. Many may say she just has her head in the sand all the time. And maybe I do. Betsy +More Ron Iles wrote: > Dear Jim, > > Your thoughtful advice is highly appreciated. Smuggling breaks national > and international law and rightfully invites re-tribution and deserves > punishment. "Ornamental" fish and other fauna are ravished for export greed > and profit in astronomic quantities to "westernised" countries for peanuts > for the usual profit and greed. If I was a poor and exploited native who > was paid peanuts to survive a sub-subsistence life in an origin country, I > would be EXTREMELY hostile to "collectors" in my back yard, to those who > clear and burn it for meats for the rich, and to ALL those who exploit me > without humanity. I might even be one of those who grow drugs in > retaliation and resentment as well as for a little money from my leaders. > For the sake of global stability and survival of ALL Nature, the collection > of small SAMPLES of flora and fauna needs to be WELCOMED because it does > backyard owners GOOD. Until that perception is justified, "THEY" are often > right to veto everything and extract the highest reciprocal price from the > white devils. When WE make it BETTER for them to keep their Jungle and use > it for benign sustainable purposes then we might expect to be welcomed > provided we BUY from them at fair market (at this desperate stage, very > high) price. We cannot expect to take thousands of rare plants worth > hundreds of thousands of dollars, for little or nothing, or even ONE plant > if it is worth multi-millions to the International pharmaceuticals or for > the fossil energy exhausting billion acre greenhouse industry. Costa Rica > allows export of millions of farmed butterflies and sometimes maybe > unendangered collected > species because their history has been far more benign and civilised and > their country has not been quite as ravished by heartless gringos. One has > with cause to pay premium price to compensate for our own mean uncaring > greed for EVERYTHING from THEIR back yard. No, its time for the privileged > to get real and look at global ENVIRONMENTAL and poor countries economic > balance sheets. Stop expecting to TAKE after "giving" with the hidden > agendas of massively taking. Maybe a few people of widest vision and > highest integrity WILL be able to get permission for Ark material to be > BOUGHT and taken out of their countries. Far from getting a free meal, > Gringos will rightly have to pay through their justly bloodied noses for > their privileges and lusts. But ever increasing hordes of nominal > "ecotourist" rampaging the backyards and taking FREE what they want. No way > and rightly so. I am beginning to wonder if I should ask expert native > BOTANISTS to collect and supply tiny samples for this Ark at FULL PRICE and > when I visit their Countries to do so to observe, support THEM and help > WITHOUT collecting. Having listened to so many people who have first hand > experience, I believe "eco-travellers" need most sensitively just to visit, > watch, shut up and listen, or pack up ang go away. > > You gringos may not like this but if you want other Countries not to do to > their Countries what you do to yours, then its time for your re-education, > a traumatic change of heart and tiny mindset. Poor (and I mean POOR in the > money sense only people deserve a happy life too and rightly couldn't care a > damn now about how you poor little rich people who want what they've got for > their playpens. You gotta PAY and PAY WELL as you always should have done > so that they feel good about YOU. The days of subserviant and compliant > slaves existing for the First World are going. If WE don't get this into > our thick heads, then all of us gringos and our manic commercial mentors > will go down in the sinking ship. If you want to save the Natural Planet, > without any more pussy footing, start REALLY caring, REALLY sharing, else > everybody will very nastily and very soon go down fighting each other to > swim in the sinking ship. The richer you are the less you'll like this. > Sorry, but sometimes things have to be said. The collecting of treasures is > rightly the responsibility of genuine experts, here professional Botanists, > not profit motivated looters and speculative art lovers. If you want > treasures for yourselves, pay the proper price and make the contracts > legitimate, truthful and open. When I go to a Host Country I pay for the > privilege as generously as I can and above that try to give of myself. I am > always welcomed back and my hosts and I like each other! > > Forthrightly > > Ron > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Multiple recipients of list AROID-L" > Sent: Friday, May 11, 2001 9:52 PM > Subject: Re: News from the Jungle > > | In a message dated 05/11/2001 2:44:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > | edggon@hotmail.com writes: > | > | << Ron... In some places (including Brazil), sending living plants > without > | the almost-impossible-to-have permits is now considered a crime, and > people > | can be arrested for it. After March this year things have become > dangerous > | around here. I has heard that things are now the same in Colombia. As an > | active plant collector (I also have a compreensive collection of some > | genera) I am not happy with this. I only want to make you know that the > | danger sometimes is not in the jungle... It is at the luggage inspection > at > | the airports! Keep you eyes opened!!! >> > | > | Dear Eduardo, Ron, et al., > | > | This list is an international assemblage but I wanted to add to what > Eduardo > | said above for the benefit of US citizens. Under a very broad-based Lacey > Act > | if you collect plants illegally in a foreign jurisdiction and return with > | them, you have committed a criminal act in the US as well. The penalties > are > | fearsome both economically and in jail time. > | > | You are at risk of apprehension at both the departure and arrival airport! > | > | Jim Langhammer > |

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