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John Criswick wrote:
Steve, itmight beworth investigating the grower whose surname is Andre, who exportedCordylinesfrom Trinidad in the early 20thcenturyand possibly late 19th. I believe that the species Anthuriumandreanum was named after him. There is a cordyline cv. named MadameEugenieAndre, who I believe was his wife. I have it in fact. Unfortunately Ican’tremember Andre’s first name. Somewhere I have a copy of a magazinepublished by the Trinidadand Tobago Horticultural Society inwhichthere is an article on Andre. I seem to think that he also grewanthuriums himselfand this was probably the common pink “West Indian” cv. of A.andreanum, which has almost disappeared now.
So herecould be yourmysterious Andre ! Obviously a person’s first name is not usuallyusedin creating botanical names, so if Andre Michaux was involved, the namewouldbe Alocasia x Amazonica Michaux.
Quitepossibly Andrewas Belgian, or if not, French.
If thisis the correctAndre, it would bring the whole thing forward by a century. I don’tknowif Andre was still around in the 1930s when Alocasia x amazonica washybridized.
Juliusmight be ableto help here, as his brother Hans in Trinidadmight have more information.
John.
From:aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com[mailto:aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com] OnBehalf Of ExoticRainforest
Sent: Saturday,November 14, 20091:37 AM
To: Discussion of aroids
Subject: [Aroid-l]AlocasiaAmazonica and Alocasia x Amazonica
Thisone is going to belong guys and gals so please stay with me!. Since many of you aregrowingthis plant you may find this interesting.
I am seeking the assistance of any and all the botanists and/or expertson thisforum since I've uncovered an apparent new mystery and can't seem toreach aresolution.
Although at least one plant seller on the internet advertises "Straightfrom the Rainforest to Your Home" while offering Alocasia Amazonica forsale this plant has never existed naturally in any rain forests of theworld.It is very well known this plant is a hybrid but the actual parentagehas beendebated. Alocasia Amazonica is likely a hybrid of Alocasia watsoniana x Alocasia sanderiana but othercrossesincluding Alocasia watsoniana x Alocasia nobilis haveproduced similarresults. Other sources have stated other parentage is involved so I'mnot surewhat the real parentage may have been, I only know it did not come fromnature.
The plant is sometimes known by the common names African Mask, GreenVelvet,Jewel Alocasia, Alocasia Polly, or Alocasia Alligator and commercialgrowershave sold it as Alocasia Frydek and as Alocasia Maxkowskii.
Botanical gardens rarely list hybrid plants on their website but if youdo aninternet search you will find the National Botanic Garden of Belgium plussome "official" sources including the University of Connecticutand the USDA listthe plant asAlocasia x Amazonica André. Unless I've got my facts totallywrong "André" refers to botanist André Michaux who lived from 1746 to1802.
SinceAlocasiaAmazonica is not a species and at least the plant we know by the nameAlocasiaAmazonica today wasn't even hybridized until the 1930's are theytalking aboutthe same plant? How could it be the same hybrid if botanist AndréMichauxwrote about it before his death in 1802?
Now, for some background for those on the forum that don't normally digintothis kind of "plant mystery":
Alocasia Amazonica is not a species and has never been described toscience It does not grow naturally in any native rain forest,is notfromthe Amazon. The name should never be used in either the italicizedformor with single quotations since it is neither a published species nor aregistered cultivar. With the help of John Banta our friend author andexpertJulius Boos was able to trace the hybrid to a nursery owner who duringthe1930's and 1940's owned a now defunct nursery in the Miami. Thenursery was known as the"Amazon Nursery" and the grower is said to have named AlocasiaAmazonica after his own business. The name has since been used bygrowers forover 70 years.
Just in case you are confused, Alocasiaspecies are all naturally found in the geographical region composed ofSoutheast Asia and neighboring island nations of the Pacific Oceanincludingthe Philippines.No Alocasia specieshas ever beenfound naturally in Central or South Americaincluding the Amazon basin although species have been imported as wellas setfree and now thrive in the area.
Just in case one of our members believes Alocasia Amazonica is aspecies hereare three scientific data bases. You won't find Alocasia Amazonica onany.
The Royal Botanic Garden Kew, London: http://www.ipni.org/index.htmlThe Missouri Botanical Garden: http://www.tropicos.org/World Checklist of Selected PlantFamilies: http://apps.kew.org/wcsp/qsearch.do
Still, it is listed on the National Botanic Garden of Belgium website: http://www.br.fgov.be/RESEARCH/COLLECTIONS/LIVING/LIVCOL/list/l_113.html
and credited to André. Some experts believe the plant did not originate in Miamiand likely was originally bred in Belgium, France or Englandsinceit is mentioned in Burnetts 'Cultivated Alocasia'. I don't have accesstothat publication so I can't check out the sources. If it washybridizedin Europe, who did it? When? Was André Michauxinvolved? Did hewrite about it? If so, where are his papers and more importantly, isitthe same plant we grow?
Are we talking about the same hybrid or was there a plant hybridizedbefore1800 in England, France or Belgiumthat also used the name Alocasia x Amazonica which was copied by thegrower in Miami?
I can normally figure these "mysteries" out with the help of Julius,Leland, Tom and Pete as well as some of our other esteemed botanistsbut thisone has me stumped. Josef, David, Wilbert and Simon, since you are in Europe do you know anything about this? I'dreallylike to understand where the name originated and if we are talkingabout thesame plant that is commonly tissue cultured and grown today.
Thanks!
Steve
www.ExoticRainforest.com
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