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 This is a continuously updated archive of the Aroid-L mailing list in a forum format - not an actual Forum. If you want to post, you will still need to register for the Aroid-L mailing list and send your postings by e-mail for moderation in the normal way.

  Pseudodracontium - RIP?
From: "StroWi at t-online.de" <StroWi at t-online.de> on 2010.05.03 at 05:17:18(20999)
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From: "StroWi at t-online.de" <StroWi at t-online.de> on 2010.05.03 at 05:17:18(21000)
Aroiders,


has ithappened?

HTML

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" <hetter at xs4all.nl> on 2010.05.03 at 15:27:46(21004)
Not yet, rest assured and hope I will die before I get it
published.............or else change all labels.

Lord P.

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" <hetter at xs4all.nl> on 2010.05.03 at 15:27:46(21005)
Not yet, rest assured and hope I will die before I get it
published.............or else change all labels.

Lord P.

+More
From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" <hetter at xs4all.nl> on 2010.05.04 at 17:04:54(21022)
For the time being there is Pseudodracontium harmandii next to
Amorphophallus harmandii (the correct name for what is otherwise known as
Am. parvulus). In due course, the Pseudodracontium name has to go when the
genera will be merged. The new name for the Pseudodracontium may turn out to
become Amorphophallus pseudoharmandii...... isn't that a nice solution!!??

Lord P(seudodracontiumneedstogo.com)

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" <hetter at xs4all.nl> on 2010.05.04 at 17:04:54(21023)
For the time being there is Pseudodracontium harmandii next to
Amorphophallus harmandii (the correct name for what is otherwise known as
Am. parvulus). In due course, the Pseudodracontium name has to go when the
genera will be merged. The new name for the Pseudodracontium may turn out to
become Amorphophallus pseudoharmandii...... isn't that a nice solution!!??

Lord P(seudodracontiumneedstogo.com)

+More
From: "Marek Argent" <abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2010.05.04 at 17:53:21(21024)
Dear Wilbert,

I know that taxonomic units are now conventional, everything is based on
clades,
but from the classic point of view what will be the position
or Pseudodracontium within the Amorphophallus, a subgenus or a section?

The second thing: the genus Amorphophallus is placed in the tribe
Thomsonieae,
named from a non-existing genus Thomsonia which is currently a part of
Amorphophallus.
Wouldn't it be better to rename the tribe to Amorphophalleae?
I have used the name Amorphophalleae since I started my www.araceum.prv.pl
and it seems to be logical.

Best,
Marek Argent

+More
From: "Marek Argent" <abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2010.05.04 at 17:53:21(21025)
Dear Wilbert,

I know that taxonomic units are now conventional, everything is based on
clades,
but from the classic point of view what will be the position
or Pseudodracontium within the Amorphophallus, a subgenus or a section?

The second thing: the genus Amorphophallus is placed in the tribe
Thomsonieae,
named from a non-existing genus Thomsonia which is currently a part of
Amorphophallus.
Wouldn't it be better to rename the tribe to Amorphophalleae?
I have used the name Amorphophalleae since I started my www.araceum.prv.pl
and it seems to be logical.

Best,
Marek Argent

+More
From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" <hetter at xs4all.nl> on 2010.05.08 at 10:06:48(21042)
Hi Marek,

An interesting suggestion: logic and botanical nomenclature in one system. I
wish you could arrange this and save us from every 5 years changing the
nomenclature code and spending expensive hours of scientists in debating
hundreds of amendmends at expensive congresses as a hobby. It is becoming a
(pseudo-)science in itself to change the code and many, many, many illogical
things are in there and unworkable complex solutions for one or two
nomenclatural occurrences in the plant kingdom (whatever that may be these
days..........). The ICNCP is like a computer programma that must fit the
needs of way too many people. Every programmer knows what that ledas
to....... Democracy at its worst.

Having moped enough: believe me, the rules force us to use
Thomsonieae............. Although the genus name Thomsonia is now part of
Amorphophallus, the name itself was legitimately published and the the
derived name Thomsonieae the oldest and correct one for the tribe. Whether
Thomsonia itself is used or not is beside the point (I know, sounds very
counterintuitive..........).

+More
From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" <hetter at xs4all.nl> on 2010.05.08 at 10:06:48(21043)
Hi Marek,

An interesting suggestion: logic and botanical nomenclature in one system. I
wish you could arrange this and save us from every 5 years changing the
nomenclature code and spending expensive hours of scientists in debating
hundreds of amendmends at expensive congresses as a hobby. It is becoming a
(pseudo-)science in itself to change the code and many, many, many illogical
things are in there and unworkable complex solutions for one or two
nomenclatural occurrences in the plant kingdom (whatever that may be these
days..........). The ICNCP is like a computer programma that must fit the
needs of way too many people. Every programmer knows what that ledas
to....... Democracy at its worst.

Having moped enough: believe me, the rules force us to use
Thomsonieae............. Although the genus name Thomsonia is now part of
Amorphophallus, the name itself was legitimately published and the the
derived name Thomsonieae the oldest and correct one for the tribe. Whether
Thomsonia itself is used or not is beside the point (I know, sounds very
counterintuitive..........).

+More
From: "Marek Argent" <abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2010.05.10 at 19:41:07(21050)
Dear Wilbert and everyone interested,

Yes, that's almost everything I wanted to know. Often the priority of the
first described taxon in a group collides with the current taxonomy, but
nothing will stop me before using the name Amorphophalleae (plus Thomsonieae
in brackets) in my website.
I know that its time will come and earlier or later the "codemasters" will
change it officially, just like in other groups of plants Caryophyllaceae
was renamed to Silenaceae, Aquifoliaceae to Ilicaceae, as it is worldwide
agreed that the higher taxa names are created from names of valid genera
(not species) or distinguishing features (as it was in the past -
Compositae, Labiatae, Monocotyledones etc).
I didn't think about such a combination when the first described genus
currently doesn't exist and the higher taxon name comes from it, anyway in
some publications I found the family name Opuntiaceae used for Cactaceae
(Cactus = currently a not existing genus) and this is identically as
Thomsonia published earlier than Amophophallus.

Well, even the science has become a part of art...

"Is it getting better?
Or do you feel the same?
Will it make it easier on you now?
You got someone to blame"

Best,
Marek

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