Myrmecophilous Monstera????

From: Adam Black <epiphyte1 at earthlink.net> on 2007.02.08 at 06:28:28(15251) While we are on the subject of shingling aroids - A friend of mine recently got back from Panama where she was doing some field work, and told me of how she found ants living under the juvenile shingling foliage of a particular Monstera species she collected as an herberium specimen. I had never heard of this occurring, and was curioius if ants do regularly live under the shingle phase leaves in a mutualistic relationship, as they are well-known to do in Hoya imbricata as well as several species of Dischidia with similar shingling habits. I just figured if it did regularly occur I would have heard about it by now. Would be curious if ants are present in Rhaphidophora as well. Just curious! Adam +More _______________________________________________ Aroid-l mailing list Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: Jonathan Ertelt <jonathan.ertelt at vanderbilt.edu> on 2007.02.08 at 16:45:23(15254) Adam, I'd be curious as to whether the ants were truly living, i.e. nesting et al. under the leaves, or just congregating and using the leaves as cover. I have seen this sort of protective usage by both ants and termites as they travel up and down tree trunks, both under shingle foliage and right in next to bare stem vines that are anchored to the trees. Of course, especially with termites, sometimes they build their own tunnels that look remarkably like thinnish bare-stemmed vines going up the tree. But all these cases I would suggest are more for travelling purposes and not habitations. I'll be interested to hear input from others. Jonathan +More While we are on the subject of shingling aroids - A friend of mine recently got back from Panama where she was doing some field work, and told me of how she found ants living under the juvenile shingling foliage of a particular Monstera species she collected as an herberium specimen. I had never heard of this occurring, and was curioius if ants do regularly live under the shingle phase leaves in a mutualistic relationship, as they are well-known to do in Hoya imbricata as well as several species of Dischidia with similar shingling habits. I just figured if it did regularly occur I would have heard about it by now. Would be curious if ants are present in Rhaphidophora as well. Just curious! Adam _______________________________________________ Aroid-l mailing list Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l _______________________________________________ Aroid-l mailing list Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: "Alistair Hay" <ajmhay at hotmail.com> on 2007.02.09 at 05:19:11(15261) I have seen this in shingling juvenile Pothos in Borneo, but whether the relationship is mutualistic I have no idea: nor aware of any research having been done... Again Peter is needed for an Old World answer! Alistair +More From: Jonathan Ertelt Reply-To: Discussion of aroids To: Discussion of aroids Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Myrmecophilous Monstera????Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 10:45:23 -0600>Adam,>>I'd be curious as to whether the ants were truly living, i.e. >nesting et al. under the leaves, or just congregating and using the >leaves as cover. I have seen this sort of protective usage by both >ants and termites as they travel up and down tree trunks, both under >shingle foliage and right in next to bare stem vines that are >anchored to the trees. Of course, especially with termites, >sometimes they build their own tunnels that look remarkably like >thinnish bare-stemmed vines going up the tree. But all these cases I >would suggest are more for travelling purposes and not habitations. >I'll be interested to hear input from others.>>Jonathan>>>>>While we are on the subject of shingling aroids - A friend of mine >>recently got back from Panama where she was doing some field work, >>and told me of how she found ants living under the juvenile >>shingling foliage of a particular Monstera species she collected as >>an herberium specimen. I had never heard of this occurring, and was >>curioius if ants do regularly live under the shingle phase leaves >>in a mutualistic relationship, as they are well-known to do in Hoya >>imbricata as well as several species of Dischidia with similar >>shingling habits. I just figured if it did regularly occur I would >>have heard about it by now. Would be curious if ants are present in >>Rhaphidophora as well.>>>>Just curious!>>>>Adam>>>>_______________________________________________>>Aroid-l mailing list>>Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l>>_______________________________________________>Aroid-l mailing list>Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l _______________________________________________ Aroid-l mailing list Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: "Peter Boyce" <botanist at malesiana.com> on 2007.02.09 at 10:58:12(15267) Pothos subgenus Allopothos contains several species with shingling habit (notably in Sarawak P. barberianus and P. ovatifolius). While I have sometimes (and on occasion memorably painfully) met with species harbouring ants (sometimes semut api - fire ants) under the leaves it does not seem to be an obligate symbiosis in action; in part it seems that species that are obligate symbionts have the shingle-leaves somewhat convex in relation to the climbing surface, thus providing a 'home' for the ants whereas these Pothos are all mainly closely pressed to the climbing surface and only ocasionally are the leaves sifficiently convex to enable ants to inhabit beneath them. For the record the juvenile of Rhaphidophora korthalsii, R. tenuis and R. beccarii are shingle-plants and R. latevaginata remains shingling throughout its entire life also occasionally harbour ants, as, too, does R. korthalsii and R. tenuis in the dense fibrous degraded cataphylls, prophylls and petiolar sheathes that clothe the active shoot tips. Peter +More ----- Original Message ----- From: Alistair Hay To: aroid-l@gizmoworks.com Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Myrmecophilous Monstera???? I have seen this in shingling juvenile Pothos in Borneo, but whether the relationship is mutualistic I have no idea: nor aware of any research having been done... Again Peter is needed for an Old World answer! Alistair From: Jonathan Ertelt Reply-To: Discussion of aroids To: Discussion of aroids Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Myrmecophilous Monstera????Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 10:45:23 -0600>Adam,>>I'd be curious as to whether the ants were truly living, i.e. >nesting et al. under the leaves, or just congregating and using the >leaves as cover. I have seen this sort of protective usage by both >ants and termites as they travel up and down tree trunks, both under >shingle foliage and right in next to bare stem vines that are >anchored to the trees. Of course, especially with termites, >sometimes they build their own tunnels that look remarkably like >thinnish bare-stemmed vines going up the tree. But all these cases I >would suggest are more for travelling purposes and not habitations. >I'll be interested to hear input from others.>>Jonathan>>>>>While we are on the subject of shingling aroids - A friend of mine >>recently got back from Panama where she was doing some field work, >>and told me of how she found ants living under the juvenile >>shingling foliage of a particular Monstera species she collected as >>an herberium specimen. I had never heard of this occurring, and was >>curioius if ants do regularly live under the shingle phase leaves >>in a mutualistic relationship, as they are well-known to do in Hoya >>imbricata as well as several species of Dischidia with similar >>shingling habits. I just figured if it did regularly occur I would >>have heard about it by now. Would be curious if ants are present in >>Rhaphidophora as well.>>>>Just curious!>>>>Adam>>>>_______________________________________________>>Aroid-l mailing list>>Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l>>_______________________________________________>Aroid-l mailing list>Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l _______________________________________________Aroid-l mailing listAroid-l@gizmoworks.comhttp://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l _______________________________________________ Aroid-l mailing list Aroid-l@gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

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