Irradation

From: plantnut plantnut at macconnect.com> on 2001.10.27 at 20:29:23(7685) What will be the effect on seeds and plants by the Post Office's new irradation machines. If you mail seeds or plants... will they be mush on arrival? What do you think? Dewey +More Your source for Tropical Araceae http://members.macconnect.com/users/p/plantnut/

From: Don Martinson llmen at wi.rr.com> on 2001.10.27 at 23:41:27(7691) >What will be the effect on seeds and plants by the Post Office's new >irradation machines. If you mail seeds or plants... will they be mush on >arrival? What do you think? >Dewey They will have to make some sort of accommodation for businesses such as seed houses and nurseries. How that may effect those of us who mail in less than bulk quantities is anyone's guess. To order a supply of my new lead-lined envelopes, go to: http://........... ;) -- Don Martinson +More Milwaukee, Wisconsin Mailto:llmen@wi.rr.com

From: Don Burns donburns at macconnect.com> on 2001.10.28 at 02:16:15(7693) >What will be the effect on seeds and plants by the Post Office's new >irradation machines. If you mail seeds or plants... will they be mush on >arrival? What do you think? Good question. The news I saw on the TV talked about "electron beam radiation". Assuming for a moment that the TV news somehow succeeded in getting it right (you U.S. news watchers know this difficult for them, of course), then what this technique probably is is a heating effect. I was at the post office this morning, and while waiting in line thought about asking the clerk if there was any written information available about the electron beam devices and how they affect other living things such as seeds. But I did not ask. I had a vision of being surrounded by men in dark suits and sun glasses. Don Burns +More Fort Lauderdale FL USA Zone 10b

From: "Derek Burch" derek at horticulturist.com> on 2001.10.28 at 03:19:22(7694) I would suggest not sending your favorite frogs through the mail. Derek ----- Original Message ----- > Milwaukee, Wisconsin +More

From: Paul Tyerman ptyerman at ozemail.com.au> on 2001.10.28 at 15:26:11(7697) At 10:21 27/10/01 -0500, you wrote: >I would suggest not sending your favorite frogs through the mail. Derek >----- Original Message ----- > Milwaukee, Wisconsin +More > Derek, Do you often send your favourite frogs through the mail????? Cheers. Paul Tyerman Canberra, Australia. USDA equivalent - Zone 8/9 mailto:ptyerman@ozemail.com.au Growing.... Galanthus, Erythroniums, Fritillarias, Crocus, Cyrtanthus, Liliums, Hellebores, Aroids, Irises plus just about anything else that doesn't move!!!!!

From: "Phil Bunch" pbunch at cts.com> on 2001.10.28 at 15:27:20(7698) Listening to a piece on NPR Friday afternoon they were discussing various methods that may be used. The electron method may not work well over the long run since electrons will not penetrate more than a few inches of paper. That means they would have to lay the mail out one or two layers thick. I don't know much about the existing mass mail processing systems but I suspect they were not designed with this in mind. Most likely mass transport is designed to use bags or boxes. There may be key points in the system where the mail is one layer thick but if so I'll bet it moves past that point vary rapidly. If it goes by too fast, it may require a very dense beam since the effective dose has to be time dependent. The higher energy systems will penetrate several feet of mail and appear to be a better choice. The dose received COULD depend on how deep the object was in the pile. Those on the top layer might get quite a dose while those on the bottom might receive less. Depending on design this might not be a significant difference. If the dose required to kill bacteria and/or viruses is relatively low one would think they would design the system to handle as much bulk as possible. At best sending seed would be a gamble. If I recall correctly the report indicted that an electron system was ready for commercial deployment but that due to this little problem one should not go out an buy stock in the manufacturer just yet. The high energy systems pose a greater exposure risk for mail handlers and this will involve some serious design issues. There are a lot of variables here! Phil Bunch Lemon Grove, California +More 32:44:00N 117:01:58W 540 feet (164 meters) amsl USDA Zone 10a Sunset Zone 23 -----Original Message----- To: Multiple recipients of list AROID-L Date: Saturday, October 27, 2001 18:18 Subject: Re: Irradation >>What will be the effect on seeds and plants by the Post Office's new >>irradation machines. If you mail seeds or plants... will they be mush on >>arrival? What do you think? > >Good question. The news I saw on the TV talked about "electron beam >radiation". Assuming for a moment that the TV news somehow succeeded in >getting it right (you U.S. news watchers know this difficult for them, of >course), then what this technique probably is is a heating effect. > >I was at the post office this morning, and while waiting in line thought >about asking the clerk if there was any written information available about >the electron beam devices and how they affect other living things such as >seeds. But I did not ask. I had a vision of being surrounded by men in dark >suits and sun glasses. > > >Don Burns >Fort Lauderdale FL USA >Zone 10b > > >

From: RThomp9589 at aol.com on 2001.10.28 at 17:01:04(7701) Given the current state of things at the post office, consider shipping anything living by another carrier. Priority mail used to be two days . My Topiflora shipment now took eight days to get here. My shipment fron Hawaii took 16 (!) days. All by supposedly the fastest means available. Rob Thompson +More California

From: Denis denis at skg.com> on 2001.10.28 at 20:05:04(7703) I don't think they can afford to irradiate everything that is mailed, just the stuff going to the Government offices in Washington DC. In the meantime I have gone back to UPS for small packages. Also, if you take parcels to the post office to mail it and insure it, it is possible they will not worry about irradiating it or sending back to you little packages of plants or envelopes of seeds. They will have your picture on file as the sender from their security cameras. Denis at Silver Krome Gardens +More plantnut wrote: > > What will be the effect on seeds and plants by the Post Office's new > irradation machines. If you mail seeds or plants... will they be mush on > arrival? What do you think? > Dewey > > Your source for Tropical Araceae > http://members.macconnect.com/users/p/plantnut/

From: Betsy Feuerstein ecuador at midsouth.rr.com> on 2001.10.29 at 03:39:17(7707) Wait a minute. Priority mail is the old first class mail and yes, they used to say two day. Actually I have shipped things this last week via Priority mail and been astounded, they were two days. Now, all be it, they were going to the west coast. I don't think they would make it quite that fast to the east coast, maybe. Overnight mail, on the other hand, this last week took five days. You figure, four plus the cost and four plus the slow. Betsy +More RThomp9589@aol.com wrote: Given the current state of things at the post office, consider shipping anything living by another carrier. Priority mail used to be two days . My Topiflora shipment now took eight days to get here. My shipment fron Hawaii took 16 (!) days. All by supposedly the fastest means available. Rob Thompson California

From: Alektra at aol.com on 2001.10.29 at 03:39:42(7709) I would suggest looking over the photography discussion groups and reading about their members' plans to deal with mailing unprocessed film. A company called Sima makes reasonably priced flexible film pouches lined with lead, which are supposed to be widely available. Physicists may correct me, but I believe anything that will beat x-rays will beat beta rays, which is what these "electron beams" are. Note, I didn't say "cheap," I said "reasonably priced," I seem to recall in the 3-5 buck range. Talk about "The Effect of Beta Rays on Man-in-the-Moon Aroids" Or was that "Gamma Rays on Marigolds..." LOL! I agree with what has been said on the list; my guess is that for the next few months, only the plant people mailing into or out of the vicinity of Washington, DC will have anything to worry about anyhow. But I don't know how people are going to ship food in metal boxes any more... granny's cookies in care packages to college students, etc. How do we know that UPS and FedEx are any "safer" for live tissue? For all we know, they are setting up these electron beams, too. This is all going to have to be dealt with, because there are too many people sending live tissue through the carriers for everything to get nailed with these beta rays-- not just our beloved aroids and other plants and seeds, but medical test samples and of course tubes of bacteria and spores for scientific purposes! +More To be perfectly honest, I think it's true what was just written in the New Yorker, that it's illogical for people to be getting scared about anthrax when influenza is much more lethal and common. My 2 cents. Best wishes, Laura

From: SelbyHort at aol.com on 2001.10.29 at 03:39:54(7710) The text below from the CDC web site in their FAQ about irradiated food (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/foodirradiation.htm#process). While not the most recent information (the page is dated 1999), it does indicate that seeds will be killed during irradiation. Hopefully UPS or Fed Ex will not resort to using this method. -Donna +More ************************************* How does irradiation affect foods? The foods are not changed in nutritional value and they are not made dangerous as a result of the irradiation. The high energy ray is absorbed as it passes through food, and gives up its energy. The food is slightly warmed. Some treated foods may taste slightly different, just as pasteurized milk tastes slightly different from unpasteurized milk. If the food still has living cells, (such as seeds, or shellfish, or potatoes) they will be damaged or killed just as microbes are.

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